The Legendary Next Update (365)

1 Name: !WAHa.06x36 2005-10-12 15:51 ID:gBva8ggI [Del]

So, as Xee is almost done, and I'm mostly waiting for external contributions, I decided it was time to start working on the Legendary Next Update for Kareha and Wakaba.

Only problem is, it's been a long time, and I've forgotten most of what needs to be done. Most of it is mentioned SOMEWHERE on the board, though. So this is your chance to pipe up with your pet feature request, or if you're feeling really helpful, to dig out some old posts that mention things that need fixing.

Hop to it!

201 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-20 18:28 ID:Heaven [Del]

> people like admins might prefer to use them

but they have capcodes now...

202 Name:   2005-10-20 19:06 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>201

Yeah, no, maybe. Using secure trips for capcodes also adds extra protections against accidentially misspellingyour capcode and leaving it open to attack.

203 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-20 20:58 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>177

> It's not worth comparing until it doesn't break regularly.

The only problem with it is that it doesn't do paranoid file writes. The fact that the entire server occasionally breaks isn't related to how broken the script itself is.

204 Name: dmpk2k!hinhT6kz2E 2005-10-20 22:43 ID:Heaven [Del]

> the entire server occasionally breaks

Occasionally?

Well, that might be it, except that on world4ch at least one board breaks every week, if not more. Incidentally, as of this writing, 4chan's /dis/ and /sug/ are also toast (third time this month?).

As it is, I can't recall ever seeing kareha break.

205 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 03:15 ID:Heaven [Del]

If we must discuss Shiichan's bug (which I believe we don't): I like the one where it sometimes turns an existing thread at the end of the All thread list into a thread with no subject, creation date set as 31 Dec 1969: 19:00 and then set to -1 posts (!) - and when you post in it, you 0GET and your IP appears as the subject.

It's a brilliant, better than fusianasan! Try it out: http://dis.4chan.org/read.php/dis/1121735647/

206 Name: 205 2005-10-21 03:39 ID:Heaven [Del]

Congratulations to 82.94.251.206!
So the subject line will look like this:
[username]<><>[unix timestamp from now]<>[content of comment box]<> <>[IP]

207 Name: 205 2005-10-21 03:40 ID:Heaven [Del]

From here on, this thread is about Kareha again:

208 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 13:46 ID:cRmds2wO [Del]

Recapping, here are the things I'd like to see in the final release:

  • better configuration of date and time (with optional timezone offsets), parsing certain characters for individual elements (ie, yyyy/MM/dd(D) hh:mm:ss -5:00:00) and also accepting numerical inputs for fixed dates and times (Eternal September)
  • config.pl parameter to permasage after a certain thread filesize/total number of characters has been reached
  • change the no-ID-on-email option to no-ID-on-sage
  • no EMAIL_ID parameter (most if not everyone uses "Heaven" anyway, and if they really want to change it they can easily find the string in kareha.pl)

Some nitpicky template adjustments to mode_message in order to more closely resemble 0ch (see http://f17.aaa.livedoor.jp/~zerotest/jikken and http://0ch.mine.nu/jikken):

  • multi-page links (1-, 101-, 201-, etc) at the top of subpages
  • red, bold thread filesize indicator near the bottom of subpages
  • "read all later posts" link just below the filesize indicator
  • non-bolded post numbers
  • colons before dates
  • colons before names (thread subpages only)
  • colons after thread position number in main page thread list
  • smaller and (at least for Pseud0ch) black and bolded title in "Create new thread" box

209 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 14:16 ID:0dCD+kFU [Del]

More information on the all threads page, date of the last post? file size?

A quote button that puts >>n and puts the post prefixed by > in the reply box

Different secret strings for different functions (e.g. one for ID generation and one for secure tripcodes)

210 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 14:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

A trigger for turning wakabamark off and one for forcing a monospace font

211 Name:   2005-10-21 14:41 ID:Heaven [Del]

> change the no-ID-on-email option to no-ID-on-sage
> multi-page links (1-, 101-, 201-, etc) at the top of subpages

Already implemented.

> config.pl parameter to permasage after a certain thread filesize/total number of characters has been reached

Isn't this essentially the same as saying "Please don't talk so much?"

> no EMAIL_ID parameter (most if not everyone uses "Heaven" anyway, and if they really want to change it they can easily find the string in kareha.pl)

The choice of this string is so weird and arbitary, I feel better keeping it as an option so that I can disclaim responsibility!

> better configuration of date and time (with optional timezone offsets), parsing certain characters for individual elements (ie, yyyy/MM/dd(D) hh:mm:ss -5:00:00) and also accepting numerical inputs for fixed dates and times (Eternal September)
> red, bold thread filesize indicator near the bottom of subpages

Pretty useless. I'd rather not waste work and code on something that has no actual use. (Timezone offsets would be useful, but this is such an incredibly hairy issue to get right, I don't want to even try. Just handling Daylight Savings Time would make my head explode, and I can't just leave it out, because then either the admin has to keep changing the offset, or the time will be wrong half the year anyway.)

> non-bolded post numbers
> colons before dates
> colons before names (thread subpages only)

what

212 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 14:44 ID:1Jq07X/h [Del]

>>210

monospace font? like this?

213 Name:   2005-10-21 14:44 ID:Heaven [Del]

> More information on the all threads page, date of the last post? file size?

That might be somewhat useful, I suppose. I'll have a look at it.

> A quote button that puts >>n and puts the post prefixed by > in the reply box

There's already a way to put in >>n. However, quoting an entire post is seldom something you want to do anyway, so I don't think that's worth cluttering up the page with a million buttons for.

> Different secret strings for different functions (e.g. one for ID generation and one for secure tripcodes)

Most admins probably don't get point of the secret string anyway, and asking them to put in several is just too annoying. In retrospect, I'd like to add a second layer of hashing to these, but that'd mean breaking secure trips AGAIN.

> A trigger for turning wakabamark off and one for forcing a monospace font

I've been trying to work out a more elegant solution for this.

214 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 15:00 ID:Heaven [Del]

>> config.pl parameter to permasage after a certain thread filesize/total number of characters has been reached
> Isn't this essentially the same as saying "Please don't talk so much?"

I am not >>208 but the first who suggested this here (long ago). I think it may be vital for future, actually popular boards to limit the filesize of a thread so that the board won't get hammered by repeated loads of whole threads without having to limit the size of posts themselves something fierce.

215 Name: 214 2005-10-21 15:03 ID:Heaven [Del]

Whoops, sorry. I read "close" instead of "permasage".
Permasage on filesize seems pretty silly, yes.

216 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 15:04 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>208

> multi-page links (1-, 101-, 201-, etc) at the top of subpages

This is just implemented on some 0ch types. 2channel doesn't use it (at least on no board that I know of).

217 Name: 214 2005-10-21 15:06 ID:Heaven [Del]

> More information on the all threads page [...] file size?

If (optional) closing on filesize should be implemented, this would probably be a good idea.

218 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 15:22 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>209

>> More information on the all threads page, date of the last post? file size?

Well, I had already proposed the filesize indicator in >>208, but optimally I would actually prefer that subback resemble the one in 0ch (ie, same as the main page thread list, but without CSS).

And single-post links don't include the thread's first post anyway, so there's no need for >>n. Quoting an entire post is not wise either.

>>211

>Isn't this essentially the same as saying "Please don't talk so much?"

In a sense, yes. Just like the postcount limit could be interpreted as "Please don't talk so long".

>what

main page -- 161 Name:◆WAHa.06x36:2005/10/21(Fri) 14:44 ID:Heaven
subpage -- 4 :◆WAHa.06x36:2005/10/21 14:44 ID:Heaven

Question: does Kareha have a 1001th post message like "Name: 1001:Over 1000 Thread" for when a thread exceeds its postcount limit?

219 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 15:25 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>216
I remember at least one or two boards on 2ch that used it, though I can't remember which (moon language and such, you see).

I apologize for the dumb question I made at the end of >>218. I forgot that Kareha permasages (not closes) a thread after the limit is exceeded, so there's no need for a hypothetical 1001th post anyway! orz

220 Name:   2005-10-21 15:45 ID:Heaven [Del]

Kareha can't use different layouts for posts on different pages, except by CSS trickery. I could add the second colon, though.

Also, I've implemented optional thread closing now, but there's no extra post. That would just be a total mess to implement, and would make re-opening threads annoying, if such a feature was requested. It replaces the posting form with a notice that the thread has been closed, instead.

221 Name:   2005-10-21 15:48 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>214

Point taken. I'll add it as an autoclose option.

222 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 16:19 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>220
I meant only using the extra post for autoclose situations where the thread has exceeded the defined postcount limit in config.pl. As for the implementation, couldn't you just have Kareha use post_stuff() and (somehow) replace the timestamp with "Over XXXX Thread"?

223 Name: 214 2005-10-21 16:41 ID:Heaven [Del]

I want a 1001th post! :(

224 Name:   2005-10-21 16:59 ID:Heaven [Del]

A 1001th post would be a bother.

225 Name: 214 2005-10-21 17:05 ID:Heaven [Del]

Okay then, for starters, how about the closing message to exactly look like a post (although it's sad it won't be accesable with >>1001)?

226 Name:   2005-10-21 17:12 ID:Heaven [Del]

That would be a bother too.

227 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 17:21 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>226
(´・ω・`)

228 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 17:35 ID:13VMAtd0 [Del]

   ∧∧
  (  ・ω・)    It's late
  _| ⊃/(___
/ └-(____/

   ∧∧
  ( ・ω・ )    Good night!
  _| ⊃/(___
/ └-(____/

  <⌒/ヽ-、___
/<_/____/
 ̄ ̄

229 Name: Shii the Metal Idol 2005-10-21 18:13 ID:z/kxsMjQ [Del]

0ch-PHP had this nifty feature where if it was a certain "high bandwidth" time of day, then you couldn't view the whole thread.

Hm... that is kind of useless on a worldwide forum, huh?

But there should still be an option to keep people from viewing more than 100-200 posts, as an emergency way of saving bandwidth.

230 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 18:43 ID:Heaven [Del]

I think it'd be a better idea to have some kind of load-balancing/distributed server cluster approach, like what dmpk2k was working on for Wakaba.

231 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 21:04 ID:Heaven [Del]

How about adding a link to 2ch in footer.html called "2ch mode"?

232 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 21:22 ID:OTpdVASB [Del]

>>231 What would it do?

233 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 22:16 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>232
Nothing! But since mode_image's footer.html includes a link to Futaba called "Futaba mode," I think mode_message should have the same.

234 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 22:20 ID:Heaven [Del]

requesting features:

  • >>n and >>q and anything else that can be used in the url.
  • a "catalog" page for wakaba, like some futaba boards have.

235 Post deleted by user.

236 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 22:34 ID:Heaven [Del]

In mode_image: shouldn't the board title be in <h1>, and the post headers in <h2>?

237 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 22:39 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>236
I mean, thread titles in <h2> and post headers in <h3>.

238 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 23:15 ID:0dCD+kFU [Del]

>Most admins probably don't get point of the secret string anyway, and asking them to put in several is just too annoying. In retrospect, I'd like to add a second layer of hashing to these, but that'd mean breaking secure trips AGAIN.

You could take the route that MrVB (I think?) did and generate the strings on first run? openssl, /dev/random, perl's random as last resort. In almost every case you are going to get a better random string than most people will supply, and if they want to change it they can. Or only have them generated if they are not supplied.

Honestly, when people care so much about anonymity they can put up with the changes required to ensure it.

239 Name:   2005-10-22 06:31 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>236

mode_image copies the Futaba/Futallaby HTML style and uses the same CSS, so yeah, it should be, and no, it won't be.

>>238

This would need writing to yet another file, and it also makes it less obvious how to get the same secret on several boards.

240 Name: 214 2005-10-22 09:22 ID:Heaven [Del]

Let's get to 1000 by "I want a pretty pony" only! ヽ(´ー`)ノ

241 Post deleted by user.

242 Name:   2005-10-22 10:53 ID:Heaven [Del]

Here's a fun little game for you all!

I'm looking into adding support for using HTML markup in addition to WakabaMark, but since most boards use XHTML, I can't just let through any old HTML, and most people can't write well-formed XHTML. Also, I don't want any cross-site scripting going on. So I've tried to write a piece of code that takes any horribly written piece of HTML, sanitizes it by removing all tags and attributes that are not an approved list, checks the attribute values, and turns it into well-formed XML.

Now I'd like to see if anyone can break this. The objective is to get some Javascript onto the page, or making the page break in Firefox (or any other browser that parses XML strictly), or otherwise causing trouble. Have at it!

http://wakaba.c3.cx/test/sanitize.pl

243 Name:   2005-10-22 10:54 ID:Heaven [Del]

If you want to have a look at what the code actually does to dig out flaws, here is the current version:

sub sanitize_html($%)
{
my ($html,%tags)=@_;
my (@stack,$clean);
my $entity_re=qr/&(?!\#[0-9]+;|\#x[0-9a-fA-F]+;|amp;)/;

while($html=~/(?:([^<]+)|<([^<>]*)>?)/g)
{
my ($text,$tag)=($1,$2);

if($text)
{
$text=~s/$entity_re/&amp;/g;
$text=~s/>/&gt;/g;
$clean.=$text;
}
else
{
if($tag=~m!^\s*(/?)\s*([a-z0-9_:\-\.]+)(?:\s+(.*?)|)\s*(/?)\s*$!si)
{
my ($closing,$name,$args,$implicit)=($1,lc($2),$3,$4);

if($tags{$name})
{
if($closing)
{
if(grep { $_ eq $name } @stack)
{
my $entry;

do {
$entry=pop @stack;
$clean.="</$entry>";
} until $entry eq $name;
}
}
else
{
my %args;

$args=~s/\s/ /sg;

while($args=~/([a-z0-9_:\-\.]+)(?:\s*=\s*(?:'([^']*?)'|"([^"]*?)"|['"]?([^'" ]*))|)/gi)
{
my ($arg,$value)=(lc($1),defined($2)?$2:defined($3)?$3:$4);
$value=$arg unless defined($value);

my $type=$tags{$name}{args}{$arg};

if($type)
{
my $passes=1;

if($type=~/url/i) { $passes=0 unless $value=~/(?:^$protocol_re:|^[^:]+$)/ }
if($type=~/number/i) { $passes=0 unless $value=~/^[0-9]+$/ }

if($passes)
{
$value=~s/$entity_re/&amp;/g;

if($value=~/"/) { $value="'$value'" }
else { $value="\"$value\"" }

$args{$arg}=$value;
}
}
}

my $cleanargs=join " ",map { "$_=$args{$_}" } keys %args;

$implicit="/" if($tags{$name}{empty});

push @stack,$name unless $implicit;

$clean.="<$name";
$clean.=" $cleanargs" if $cleanargs;
$clean.=" $implicit" if $implicit;
$clean.=">";
}
}
}
}
}

my $entry;
while($entry=pop @stack) { $clean.="</$entry>" }

return $clean;
}

244 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 10:55 ID:Heaven [Del]

I don't know if this is a bug or not, but could you change the Futaba template so that hovering over/clicking on a post header doesn't count as doing the same to the deletion checkbox next to it? Same goes for the "[File Only]" area at the bottom with its checkbox.

245 Name:   2005-10-22 10:56 ID:Heaven [Del]

Wow, >>243 sure looks like shit in Safari. What the hell? Looks right in Firefox, though.

246 Name:   2005-10-22 10:57 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>244

Er, that's a feature, not a bug. That's how most GUIs act.

247 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 12:15 ID:Heaven [Del]

Why would there be any use in writing actual HTML in posts? Seems to me like it's just inviting abuse.

248 Name: 214 2005-10-22 12:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

It's also more markup when even the existing one isn't working as well as it should.

249 Name:   2005-10-22 12:43 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>247

Well, you have your chance to try and abuse it over on the test page. Although the list of allowed tags there doesn't exactly match what would be allowed here.

Also, the point is to make the type of markup selectable, so you can pick WakabaMark or HTML or none at all.

250 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 12:58 ID:tsGarR30 [Del]

>>249 Then the default should be no markup.

251 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 13:00 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>249
<a href> opens up the possibility of using inline links, and img tags allow bandwidth leeching from other sites (plus the fact that the image itself may be unsanitary).

252 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 13:11 ID:Heaven [Del]

Plus if you were to allow those tags in HTML, you should do the same for WakabaMark (which actually takes its cue from Markdown, so I don't see why it has a different name).

253 Name:   2005-10-22 13:12 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>251

Again, the list of tags allowed on that page don't correspond to what would be allowed in Kareha. Of course <img> tags wouldn't be allowed, for instance. This is just for testing the actual cleanup engine.

254 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 13:17 ID:Heaven [Del]

Partition for renaming "WakabaMark" to "WAHaMARk"!

255 Name:   2005-10-22 13:19 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>254

You'd be destroying the DUMB PUN!

256 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 13:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>255
By replacing it with AN EVEN DUMBER PUN!

257 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 14:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

Semantical nitpick: shouldn't the "Page top" link be called "Thread list"?

258 Name:   2005-10-22 14:47 ID:Heaven [Del]

Maybe. I just picked something at random.

259 Name: coda 2005-10-22 15:01 ID:1jzeBBcT [Del]

the text

c < d

causes a <d> tag to be opened, which is not on the list, and therefore all the text until the next tag will be deleted. a better behavior in this case would be to just convert that < to &lt;. you even ought to do this for

a < b

too, despite the fact that b is a valid tag, because who the hell leaves the closing angle bracket out of their HTML tag?

creating the correct regexes for this is an exercise left to the reader.

260 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 16:20 ID:Heaven [Del]

This is the obligatory encoding test ... in <code>

 ㋋㏡
ゔ〲〰 ゔ〲〲〰〰 ゔ〲〰 ゔ〲〰 ゔ〲〰ゔ 〲〰ゔ 〲〰ゔ〲〲〰ゔゔ
〳〵ヷヷヷヷ〰〰〰〳〵ヷヷヷヷ〰〰〰〳〵ヷヷヷヷ〰〰〰
(♛ฺД)(*゜∀゜)~♡ℳฺℴฺℯฺ❤ℒฺℴฺνℯฺ..._〆(゜▽゜*)㌰㌰ ㍉㍍㌧㌔㌶㍊㌣㌦
㌀㌁㌂㌃㌄㌅㌆㌇㌈㌉㌊㌋㌌☠ฺ ☠ฺ ☠ฺ ☠ฺ ☠ฺ ☠ฺ ☠ฺ ☠ฺ ☠ฺ
☼♭♬♫♨♩♧♦♥♤♣♢♠♡♐ฺ♑ฺ♒ฺ♓ฺ ♔ฺ♕ฺ ♖

ฺ ♗ฺ♘ฺ♙ฺ♚ฺ♛ฺ♜ฺ♝(・∀・)/ヾ~~╋┓!㋦㋸㋭°

|壁|」゜ρ゜)」 ノ ヽ``~ 力㋦㋸㋭°
     / ⌒ヽ  
   / ´_ゝ`) I am sorry、 the β α κ α kopipe couldn't be carried out・・・
  |     /
   | /|  |
  // |  |
 U   .U  

261 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 16:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

http://wakaba.c3.cx/test/sanitize.pl?html=%3Ccode%3E+%E3%8B%8B%E3%8F%A1%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A+%E3%82%94%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0+%E3%82%94%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B0+%E3%82%94%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0+%E3%82%94%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0+%E3%82%94%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0%E3%82%94+%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0%E3%82%94+%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0%E3%82%94%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B2%E3%80%B0%E3%82%94%E3%82%94%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E3%80%B3%E3%80%B5%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B3%E3%80%B5%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B3%E3%80%B5%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%83%B7%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B0%E3%80%B0%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%28%E2%99%9B%E0%B8%BA%D0%94%29%28*%E3%82%9C%E2%88%80%E3%82%9C%29%EF%BD%9E%E2%99%A1%E2%84%B3%E0%B8%BA%E2%84%B4%E0%B8%BA%E2%84%AF%E0%B8%BA%E2%9D%A4%E2%84%92%E0%B8%BA%E2%84%B4%E0%B8%BA%CE%BD%E2%84%AF%E0%B8%BA..._%E3%80%86%28%E3%82%9C%E2%96%BD%E3%82%9C*%29%E3%8C%B0%E3%8C%B0+%E3%8D%89%E3%8D%8D%E3%8C%A7%E3%8C%94%E3%8C%B6%E3%8D%8A%E3%8C%A3%E3%8C%A6%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E3%8C%80%E3%8C%81%E3%8C%82%E3%8C%83%E3%8C%84%E3%8C%85%E3%8C%86%E3%8C%87%E3%8C%88%E3%8C%89%E3%8C%8A%E3%8C%8B%E3%8C%8C%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA+%E2%98%A0%E0%B8%BA%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E2%98%BC%E2%99%AD%E2%99%AC%E2%99%AB%E2%99%A8%E2%99%A9%E2%99%A7%E2%99%A6%E2%99%A5%E2%99%A4%E2%99%A3%E2%99%A2%E2%99%A0%E2%99%A1%E2%99%90%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%91%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%92%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%93%E0%B8%BA+%E2%99%94%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%95%E0%B8%BA+%E2%99%96%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%97%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%98%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%99%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%9A%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%9B%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%9C%E0%B8%BA%E2%99%9D%28%EF%BD%A5%E2%88%80%EF%BD%A5%29%2F%E3%83%BE%7E%7E%E2%95%8B%E2%94%93%21%E3%8B%A6%E3%8B%B8%E3%8B%AD%C2%B0%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%7C%E5%A3%81%7C%E3%80%8D%E3%82%9C%CF%81%E3%82%9C%29%E3%80%8D%E3%80%80%E3%83%8E+%E3%83%BD%60%60%EF%BD%9E+%E5%8A%9B%E3%8B%A6%E3%8B%B8%E3%8B%AD%C2%B0%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E2%80%89%E3%80%80+%E3%80%80+%EF%BC%8F%E2%80%89%E2%8C%92%E3%83%BD+%E2%80%89%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E3%80%80%E2%80%89%E3%80%80%2F%E3%80%80%C2%B4_%E3%82%9D%60%EF%BC%89+I+am+sorry%E3%80%81%E2%80%89the+%CE%B2%E2%80%89%CE%B1%E2%80%89%CE%BA%E2%80%89%CE%B1%E2%80%89kopipe+couldn%27t+be+carried+out%E3%83%BB%E3%83%BB%E3%83%BB%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E3%80%80%E3%80%80%7C%E3%80%80%E2%80%89+%E3%80%80%E3%80%80%2F%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E2%80%89%E3%80%80%E3%80%80%7C+%2F%7C%E2%80%89%E3%80%80%7C%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E3%80%80+%2F%2F%E3%80%80%7C+%E2%80%89%7C%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E%0D%0A%E3%80%80%EF%BC%B5%E2%80%89%E3%80%80+.%EF%BC%B5+%E2%80%89%3C%2Fcode%3E%3Cbr+%2F%3E

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

262 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 16:46 ID:Heaven [Del]

"page top" is better imho

263 Name:   2005-10-22 16:55 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>259

Fixed.

>>260-261

The test script doesn't try to handle charsets at all at the moment.

264 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 18:51 ID:Heaven [Del]

Random post: The test thread could use some linking in the notes at the bottom (what's the common nomenclature for that one?).

265 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 14:24 ID:Heaven [Del]

All right, code updated again. This time, some experimenting! I've implemented a tentative system for changing markup types. This needs a bunch of testing, of course, so here's the test thread link once again: http://wakaba.c3.cx/sup/kareha.pl/1099697376/

Thoughts and comments are welcome. I'm still trying to figure out how exactly to do this.

There's a bunch of other changes and fixes too, so mention if anything breaks, as usual. Also, shift-reload!

266 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 14:52 ID:Heaven [Del]

ugh "More options..."

too much clickable elements! and it doesn't even do anything (Firefox 1.0.7 here)!

out! out!

267 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 14:53 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>266

I told you to shift-reload!

268 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 15:00 ID:Heaven [Del]

I hate that blue link next to the reply box! It looks ugly!

Also, there's no "Less options..."

Can't this be somewhere else but the post form?

269 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 15:11 ID:Heaven [Del]

> Can't this be somewhere else but the post form?

No, because that would be immensely useless and annoying, because nobody would know it's there, and even if they did, they'd have to go somewhere else every time they wanted to post something using a different markup.

270 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 15:47 ID:Heaven [Del]

The problem reported in >>143 is still present.

271 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 16:32 ID:Heaven [Del]

Did you ditch customizable capcodes?

How about placing the Formatting menu to the left or right of the "File: " field? I'd also like to see WakabaMark changed to its real name (Markdown).

A few other considerations:

  • Using "◆" as the default tripkey character.
  • No need for the "Navigation: " text before the navigation links in subpages
  • In Pseud0ch, post numbers should be the same size/format as the rest of the header text
  • I'm still thinking that subback should be as minimal as possible: no navlinks, title, or last post/filesize data. Then again, I'm from the school of following 0ch blindly.
  • Variable admin permissions per password
  • Is the Admin bar gonna come back before the final version?

Small details aside, this is seriously shaping up to be an amazing release. Your efforts are much appreciated, WAHa.

272 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 16:33 ID:Heaven [Del]

PS. What's "Raw HTML"?

273 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 16:34 ID:Heaven [Del]

Oh, and "AA mode" should be changed to "Text art mode" so we won't be incessantly quibbling about the difference between ASCII and SJIS art.

274 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 16:52 ID:Heaven [Del]

> Did you ditch customizable capcodes?

No, I removed the dumbass capcode I put in as a demonstration, because I don't like capcodes.

> Using "◆" as the default tripkey character.

I dunno, I always thought that was a kind of big and annoying symbol. Especially when it's so close visually to the question-mark-in-diamond marker some fonts use for characters they don't support.

> How about placing the Formatting menu to the left or right of the "File: " field? I'd also like to see WakabaMark changed to its real name (Markdown).

The File field is almost never there. Also, WakabaMark is similar to, but not the same as Markdown. There are significant differences that make them incompatible (since Markdown is designed to be used when you know you're using it, but WakabaMark tries as best as it can to not do unexpected things if you don't know about it). I might add optional support for real Markdown at some point.

> In Pseud0ch, post numbers should be the same size/format as the rest of the header text

I tried, and it looked much worse than the current solution. Besides, post numbers in Kareha and 0ch aren't the same, since they're clickable here.

> PS. What's "Raw HTML"?

Pretty useless. I'll probably remove it. It's HTML input without turning newlines into <br/>.

> Oh, and "AA mode" should be changed to "Text art mode"

Maybe just "Text art"... hmm.

275 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 16:53 ID:Heaven [Del]

> The File field is almost never there.

...especially not when I've added a bug that makes it disappear. Where the hell did it go?

276 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 17:40 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>275
Heh, I thought you had disabled it manually.

>The File field is almost never there.

Right, and when it isn't, the Formatting menu can still reside on the same line.

The error page in mode_message should more closely resemble that of 0ch (complete with "ERROR!" title).

277 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 17:59 ID:Heaven [Del]

All right, made another small update. Needs a shift-reload again to work quite right (there's a short description of the various markup modes now). Also fixed >>143 and removed "Raw HTML".

278 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 18:02 ID:Heaven [Del]

Text Art's description about auto-linking URLs and >> references is redundant. Not a bad solution with the layout, though (hiding the menu behind "More options..." still bugs me).

279 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 18:05 ID:gBva8ggI [Del]

>>278

How do you figure it's redundant?

280 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 18:15 ID:Heaven [Del]

Hmmm, I just noticed you still allow <a> tags, which would let posters use inline links. Are you gonna keep that?

281 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 18:18 ID:Heaven [Del]

<a href="#">Is that true?</a>

282 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 18:24 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>280

I'm not sure. On the one hand, people expect that to work. On the other hand, it can be a bit annoying. On the third hand, it's not all that annoying anyway.

284 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 18:27 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>279
Every mode auto-links URLs and >> references, or at least they should (HTML mode doesn't for some reason).

>>281
Well the description is outdated, then. :P

In any case, inserting an ASCII carriage return in HTML mode still renders as a line break. Bug or feature?

285 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 18:38 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>284

HTML mode handles >> references, but not URLs because I've been too lazy to figure out a regexp that would handle that correctly. Also, yes, newlines are converted to <br /> intentionally. This matches how most sites that accept HTML markup work.

286 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 19:13 ID:Heaven [Del]

> The error page in mode_message should more closely resemble that of 0ch (complete with "ERROR!" title).

Signed. And the style selector on the error page is pretty useless.

287 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 19:25 ID:Heaven [Del]

Oh, and the navigation bar on the error page should probably look like the one on the thread page.

288 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 19:30 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>287
0ch's error page provides a link to return to the board from which the error originated, which I think is pretty reasonable. Sometimes I think the navigation bar and CSS selector are used somewhat excessively in mode_message (though the latter's presence has been diminished significantly throughout the course of this thread).

289 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 19:40 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>288

Return links are actually not a very good idea. I know some browsers will clear all input fields if you follow a link back to the page you came from, but leave the fields intact if you click the back button.

290 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 19:44 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>289
Well, you have links now in the current incarnation. I would think that this kinda thing (Return link vs. Back button) would be common knowledge by now among regular Internet users.

291 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 19:54 ID:Heaven [Del]

No "2ch mode" link in the footer? I think Hiroyuki deserves some credit.

292 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 20:18 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>269
> No, because that would be immensely useless and annoying, because nobody would know it's there,

Nobody knows how to use WakabaMark as it is now either and I don't see a big fat ugly WakabaMark FAQ next to the post form either.

> and even if they did, they'd have to go somewhere else every time they wanted to post something using a different markup.

I am just guessing here, but I am pretty sure most people will only change their settings in very rare cases.
I really think this is something that would be more useful in some sort of browser extension than in the actual software.

293 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 20:19 ID:Heaven [Del]

Man, this really is annoying.

Partition for unified encoding! Outsource Markup to the select few who want it (I am pretty sure the vast majority of users can live without it).

294 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 20:38 ID:Heaven [Del]

> I don't see a big fat ugly WakabaMark FAQ next to the post form either.

You don't see the link to the WakabaMark page either?

> I am just guessing here, but I am pretty sure most people will only change their settings in very rare cases.

I just added the Text Art mode so that people could post AA on any board and have it work right, but the only way for that to work is if you can quickly change modes between posts.

Look, it's getting just a tiny bit annoying with the complaining. I've been putting a huge amount of effort into making this work well both for those who want markup and those who don't. If you don't like it, you turn it off and don't need to bother with it again. There's just a tiny little link there to let people do this. Is this really a such a huge bother to deal with? It's *two words*.

295 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 20:39 ID:Heaven [Del]

Hmm, apparently there's some sort of bug in there still, since it's not marking up that.

296 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 20:44 ID:Heaven [Del]

Should be fixed now.

297 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 20:52 ID:Heaven [Del]

How about appending an estimated (at the time of thread creation) time of pruning to the first post's header, if pruning-by-age is enabled?

298 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 20:54 ID:Heaven [Del]

Currently, pruning by age is measured from the time of the newest post in the thread, so it wouldn't really work. I'm not sure if this is the best behaviour or not, but it seems it makes more sense to kill threads nobody cares about than to kill slow-moving threads just because they get old.

299 Name: anon!21anon4H3U : 2005-10-23 21:48 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>294 Hey I like the new formatting bit. Should it collapse back down if you click away or if you click the "More options..." bit again, like the text box?

Just a thought. This setup is easier and more obvious than using the link field, with "AA" or "Wakabamark". BTW, I just realized that was a pun. Boo! Hiss! Not punny! :)

300 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-23 23:06 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>299
Seconded. This'll go a long way to resolving headaches with WakabaMark and SJIS art, and there really isn't anything egregious about its current implementation into the mode_message template (nothing compared to putting it in a separate area, for example)

Going back to the CSS selector: since switching styles is not inherently supported in all browser GUIs, how about having a third party create extensions for those browsers and freeing up the real estate on the actual page? The selector to me seems out of place with the rest of the layout, simply because it's only there for the purpose of presentation, not the actual page content. How many people out there change styles from board defaults on a regular basis because of readability preferences?
This thread has been closed. You cannot post in this thread any longer.