The Legendary Next Update (365)

94 Name:   2005-10-17 14:06 ID:gBva8ggI [Del]

> Put the Entire thread link on the top of the thread, not the bottom.

Well, since the current update has removed almost all links to entire threads, I won't do THAT, but I guess a Last 50 link could be snuck in somewhere... Maybe the thread title should be an l50 link?

123 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-18 07:27 ID:Heaven [Del]

Some semantical nitpicking: "replies" should probably be changed to "posts", since >>1 is not really a reply, which makes >>100 the 99th reply to a thread, thus contradicting the "First 100 replies" thing. Same goes for "Next 100 replies" and "Last 50 replies".

224 Name:   2005-10-21 16:59 ID:Heaven [Del]

A 1001th post would be a bother.

196 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-20 12:51 ID:tlSRz7E3 [Del]

>>189

>The effect would be miniscule in comparison to the huge increase in bandwidth that would result from sending the entire static thread pages.

How about a config.pl parameter to split up thread subpages into X posts per page? The navigation links already use 100 posts per page for practically everything except "Last 50 posts".

Hmm, I just remembered: >> links would not work at all with static pages. Not good.

>Why? Even if 0ch or Futaba implemented secure tripcodes, you wouldn't get the same secure tripcode there as on another board. That's the nature of the security.

Right, I guess it was dumb to mention 0ch/Futaba in the first place. The point is, as you said yourself, tripcodes are a gimmick, and if someone wants to maintain a persistent identity across multiple boards and sites (ie, everyone here with a tripcode), they have no choice but to use ordinary tripcodes. Secure tripcodes are useless because they limit your identity to a single board, supposing each board/site's cipher key is different -- which it should be, since that's the point of having a secure tripcode in the first place. No one should be so paranoid about a tripcode that they'd need to have a different one per board/site.

>Not without doing a lot of changes throughout the code, and not without breaking current installations.

Shouldn't we sacrifice some backwards compatibility for a more robust and scalable design? It might even be possible to provide an upgrade.pl for old threads.

>>193

>You could only trigger the functions in a specific format, say...

That's a cool idea, though for now it would have to be left alone if we want to keep Kareha compatible with 2ch/Futaba conventions.

>>195
Exactly. The methods and the effects of saging a thread are separate subjects.

P.S. I recently discovered "rXX-XX" for threads in /soc/. How exactly does this work? From the sound of it, it's supposed to randomize the post order, but when I hit refresh I get the same order.

157 Name:   2005-10-19 14:11 ID:gBva8ggI [Del]

>>153

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Domain

It means anyone can do whatever they want with it. They can't claim copyright, though, since they didn't create it in the first place. They can modify it an claim copyright on their modifications, at least as long as they're significant enough, but that doesn't affect existing works in the public domain.

> This is kinda what I had pushed for earlier in >>52. I think that separating the sage (aka, "don't bump"), fusianasan (aka, "show IP"), and ID:Heaven (aka, "no ID") functions from any particular post elements in the main scripts would be ideal for implementing Kareha in systems where inputting a certain string to trigger these functions is not intuitive (ie, every board outside of the 2ch/Futaba family). These trigger strings (S_DONTBUMP, S_SHOWIP, S_NOID) and their assignment to a certain form field input could be instead implemented individually in each template.

There's no obvious way to do this, since there has to be code that specifically checks a field and takes certain actions long before the template comes into play. It'd take some sort of plugin system to implement it, and I don't think that's quite called for.

Also >>154 is Kami.

2 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-12 16:25 ID:hjzD4Li4 [Del]

How about listing what dmpk2k or you have done already?

  1. Split threads and posts into separate tables. You're repeating the lasthit and parent column over and over.

285 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 18:38 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>284

HTML mode handles >> references, but not URLs because I've been too lazy to figure out a regexp that would handle that correctly. Also, yes, newlines are converted to <br /> intentionally. This matches how most sites that accept HTML markup work.

27 Name: ¦ 2005-10-14 00:38 ID:Heaven [Del]

Test with ¦

324 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-26 18:34 ID:Heaven [Del]

> forced fusianasan

that seems kind of evil.

238 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 23:15 ID:0dCD+kFU [Del]

>Most admins probably don't get point of the secret string anyway, and asking them to put in several is just too annoying. In retrospect, I'd like to add a second layer of hashing to these, but that'd mean breaking secure trips AGAIN.

You could take the route that MrVB (I think?) did and generate the strings on first run? openssl, /dev/random, perl's random as last resort. In almost every case you are going to get a better random string than most people will supply, and if they want to change it they can. Or only have them generated if they are not supplied.

Honestly, when people care so much about anonymity they can put up with the changes required to ensure it.

106 Name: qube3.mackey.miyazaki.miyazaki.jp 2005-10-17 15:49 ID:JzjmoL7r [Del]

test

210 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 14:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

A trigger for turning wakabamark off and one for forcing a monospace font

294 Name: !WAHa.06x36 : 2005-10-23 20:38 ID:Heaven [Del]

> I don't see a big fat ugly WakabaMark FAQ next to the post form either.

You don't see the link to the WakabaMark page either?

> I am just guessing here, but I am pretty sure most people will only change their settings in very rare cases.

I just added the Text Art mode so that people could post AA on any board and have it work right, but the only way for that to work is if you can quickly change modes between posts.

Look, it's getting just a tiny bit annoying with the complaining. I've been putting a huge amount of effort into making this work well both for those who want markup and those who don't. If you don't like it, you turn it off and don't need to bother with it again. There's just a tiny little link there to let people do this. Is this really a such a huge bother to deal with? It's *two words*.

171 Name: Shii the Metal Idol 2005-10-19 20:51 ID:z/kxsMjQ [Del]

>>170
But my good man, sage means down.

> Also, how is Kahera unrivaled when there are still large sites that are not running it? Shiichan is still on world4ch, Thorn on parts of wakachan for example.

These are temporary problems because the webmasters of both sites are too stubborn to upgrade.

189 Name:   2005-10-20 11:10 ID:Heaven [Del]

> Another topic: since dynamic pages eat up CPU in order to rebuild pages according to URL parameters, what would be the likelihood of the current dynamic thread subpages having a significantly adverse effect in this aspect if a board were to grow to 2ch-sized proportions?

The effect would be miniscule in comparison to the huge increase in bandwidth that would result from sending the entire static thread pages.

The "entire thread" link can easily be changes to link to the files in /res/ instead of going through the script, but that would make it somewhat less convenient when you want to consturct custom URLs, so I haven't done it.

> Also, let's put out a partition to kill secure tripcodes (unless they originated from 0ch/Futaba)

Why? Even if 0ch or Futaba implemented secure tripcodes, you wouldn't get the same secure tripcode there as on another board. That's the nature of the security.

> captcha (until we find a way to implement similar functionality without requiring it in the form of a GIF/PNG image)

That's even more non-sensical. Nobody on the entire internet has figured out a reasonable way to implement captcha except by using images, and the only boards that use them are image boards where you have to load images anyway. And finally, they aren't just there to annoy you, people do actually try to flood boards, and they are stopped by the captcha.

> And is there any practical way that Kareha can be modified to run multiple (even nested) boards in a single installation?

Not without doing a lot of changes throughout the code, and not without breaking current installations.

38 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-14 13:56 ID:Heaven [Del]

> Thorough search functionality a-la notchan, using PATH_INFO. This might not be possible without implementing a per-post metadata system though.

I think this not something that needs to be part of the software itself.
Besides, Google mostly provides that function just fine with site:blahblahblah.com blah

Also, what is "user deletion"?

171 Name: Shii the Metal Idol 2005-10-19 20:51 ID:z/kxsMjQ [Del]

>>170
But my good man, sage means down.

> Also, how is Kahera unrivaled when there are still large sites that are not running it? Shiichan is still on world4ch, Thorn on parts of wakachan for example.

These are temporary problems because the webmasters of both sites are too stubborn to upgrade.

241 Post deleted by user.

238 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-21 23:15 ID:0dCD+kFU [Del]

>Most admins probably don't get point of the secret string anyway, and asking them to put in several is just too annoying. In retrospect, I'd like to add a second layer of hashing to these, but that'd mean breaking secure trips AGAIN.

You could take the route that MrVB (I think?) did and generate the strings on first run? openssl, /dev/random, perl's random as last resort. In almost every case you are going to get a better random string than most people will supply, and if they want to change it they can. Or only have them generated if they are not supplied.

Honestly, when people care so much about anonymity they can put up with the changes required to ensure it.

142 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-18 22:44 ID:Heaven [Del]

The Futaba template is missing the "No File" checkbox next to the File field in the Post New Thread area.

314 Name: Anonymous : 2005-10-24 19:40 ID:0dCD+kFU [Del]

I vote yes, but that is obvious isn't it?

68 Name: 61 2005-10-17 07:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

http://wakaba.c3.cx/sup/kareha.pl/1099697376/101-101
(First "Next 100" link) does not include >>1 in that thread

There's also some weird bug where the entire browser windowd content goes black, dunno what that is about...

161 Name: 148 2005-10-19 16:30 ID:0dCD+kFU [Del]

RENZOKU are the flood detection things... even if they are useless MAX_POSTS_PER_MINUTE makes a lot more sense than RENZOKU2

3) was about a string to trigger ID:Heaven, not a constant for the Heaven part (which is already configurable)

Re: email/link field

Just because it works one way on 2ch/whatever does not mean it is the best way. Having 'fusianasan' as the only way to trigger the effect is just narrow-minded. Functions should have descriptive names to the people using them; should we keep the field names in Japanese because the Japanese have them in Japanese? Having all of the applicable things configurable is something that makes sense, and you can easily have both 'fusianasan' and 'show_ip' that work at the same time. Frankly, the combinations of many things into unrelated fields is a design flaw. What if you want to use a name/trip and fusianasan? What if your email address contains the string 'sage'? What if you want to sage a thread, but have an ID still?
I think the confusion of existing users is worth reducing the learning curve and improving the intuitiveness.

I'm not saying that the default behaviour needs to change, but being able to easily configure the strings used allows for easier localization.

I probably misspelled fusianasan too, why should I have to remember something so foreign?

97 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-17 14:14 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>96
forgot to mention that maybe a parameter could be included in config.pl to define an XHTML file for the disclaimer/rules block. It could be used both in 2ch and Futaba (right under the posting area) modes.

122 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-18 06:32 ID:Heaven [Del]

About the etyomology of "fusianasan":
http://4-ch.net/nihongo/kareha.pl/1102656968/224-

262 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 16:46 ID:Heaven [Del]

"page top" is better imho

256 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-22 13:23 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>255
By replacing it with AN EVEN DUMBER PUN!

42 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-14 16:30 ID:Heaven [Del]

Forgot this one:
The general functions of imageboards do not seem to be clear to most people that eventually come around, the influx of total newbies is still big. Many neither know what sage is, how to properly reply to threads, what tripcodes are, etc.
Because of that, I believe it would be good to include a default link at the bottom of the unordered list at the bottom of the new thread form that links to http://wakaba.c3.cx/docs/docs.html#UsersGuide

Relevant:
http://dis.iichan.net/idc/kareha.pl/1128824710/12-

117 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-18 04:04 ID:Heaven [Del]

>>116
Good question! I tried to find out myself but just found some interesting but rather unhelpful links:
http://d.hatena.ne.jp/keyword/fusianasan
http://info.2ch.net/guide/faq.html#G5
http://ansitu.xrea.jp/guidance/?FAQ1

85 Name: Anonymous 2005-10-17 12:26 ID:1l2MEdqn [Del]

I'll sign that partition for a separate admin script and XHTML interface (one that includes the banning, board nuking, and spamlist-changing functions in Wakaba).

How about adding flexibility to the DELETE_FIRST option in config.pl, using booleans to define when to keep or remove a thread (including AND/OR/NOT arguments)?

Also, options for both automated permasaging and pruning by postcount, creation date/time, and board position (all configurable in config.pl of course).

Some other layout points:

  • The Title field should go above the Name and Link fields in 2ch mode.
  • 2ch's "new thread" post box is at the bottom of the main page. From every practical standpoint, the current solution in Kareha is a lot more convenient, but you may want to go over that just in case.
  • Futaba now uses "..." instead of ">>>" to prefix repy blocks.
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